Phantom Datacenters

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Jason Howell
This episode of the AI Inside podcast is sponsored by your 360. I get 10% off through January 2026 by using code inside.

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Jason Howell
Coming up next, Jeff Jarvis and I explore Google's next gen XR hardware that I got to experience firsthand. Pretty cool stuff. Meta. Step back from mixed reality and how AI and XR are becoming inseparable. Plus, we also break down the US-China chip shuffle that's happening right now. New alliances for AI agents and Pebble smart ring. That's very different from the rest.

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Jason Howell
Coming up next on the AI and side podcast.

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Jason Howell
Hello everybody, and welcome to another episode of the AI Inside Podcast, the show where we take a look at the AI that is layered throughout the world of technology. I'm one of your hosts, Jason Howell. The other host is Jeff Jarvis. You know him. You love him. Mr. Jarvis, how you doing?

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Jeff Jarvis
Good to see you, boss. How are you?

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Jason Howell
You too. I'm doing all right. A little, little chilly. Although I like.

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Jeff Jarvis
What I want to hear. I want to hear. Yeah. How chilly is it there?

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Jason Howell
Yeah. You know, it's West Coast. Chilly, I get it.

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Jeff Jarvis
It was a high, not a here yesterday. And I just got back from the mountains of Austria and the Tyrol. It was cold there, too.

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Jason Howell
It looks like you're kind of wearing your your. It's cold here. Jacket. There's a little.

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Jeff Jarvis
Where I had have.

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Jason Howell
The turtleneck.

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Jeff Jarvis
I'm well on my socials. I do have pictures of me. If you if you go, I have a picture of me wearing each Rollie and jacket.

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Jason Howell
Is that the jacket that's in our podcast art?

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Jeff Jarvis
I don't think because actually.

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Jason Howell
Because I was on, let's see here I'm trying to find where do I find that that would be on our Patreon when I was on Intelligent Machines last week, which was a ton of fun. Leo kind of called out the the the, the art that we have at the top of our Patreon, which is you looking like all Highlander.

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Jason Howell
Yeah, I was that was like, yeah, that was that. That's dollars. Okay. Different jacket.

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Jeff Jarvis
Shorter beard. So I'll put in the, I'll send you now me in the jacket on the first I got to find, you know, I've been there they were Jason Hole there. Let's see here. And, I sent you a text.

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Jason Howell
Oh, of me is so.

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Jeff Jarvis
Really in mufti.

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Jason Howell
Oh. Okay. Give me one second. I will vamp as I move this over on to the magical machine. Magical mystery machine. There we go. Okay, rocket.

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Jeff Jarvis
Tree, captain von drop of me,

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Jason Howell
Very much so. Are you wearing this jacket right now? Is that the jacket that you're wife? No, I'm not there. Oh, okay.

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Jeff Jarvis
I'm just wearing this is.

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Jason Howell
This is fancy jacket. This is not everyday jacket.

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Jeff Jarvis
It's a really fancy jacket there. Yeah, but, yeah, I was afraid it was a cultural appropriation, but they were amused that the American came wearing their uniform.

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Jason Howell
Hahaha. Well, it looks good on you. It works. It works well. Welcome back. Folks who, you know, subscribe on on YouTube or podcast feed. Definitely notice that there was an extra episode. We had an episode appear on Monday because last Friday I went out to Google and, got to take a look at a few very cool things.

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Jason Howell
And then I was kind of surprised at the opportunity because at the end of it, it was like, okay, let's go into this room and talk for a little bit. And I kind of knew that was coming, but I didn't realize I had as long as I had with Justin Payne, who basically, you know, is is a product manager, senior director of product management for XR at Google.

00:03:46:00 - 00:04:06:02
Jason Howell
And I have like 35 or 40 minutes with him. I was like, oh, you want to just do a podcast? And I had the gear to do it. So we did the podcast. That's what you got on Monday was the chat with Justin. May have, it may have been a little out of context because it's like it's the chat about XR, but we don't really talk about like the stuff that Google announced.

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Jason Howell
I mean, you were kind of seeing some of this stuff from the news kind of cycle. Was there anything that that stood out for you as far as kind of the current Google thing around XR and their their headsets and glasses and all that?

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Jeff Jarvis
XR slash air, right?

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Jason Howell
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, I mean, I when I think XR, I kind of think XR is like the catchall for all of it. It's like external reality. That's how I think about it. Maybe I'm wrong, but you know, so I kind of put it all into the XS. I, you.

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Jeff Jarvis
Know, some people, some people dismiss XR. Yeah, yeah. So, no, I think it sounds like a smart strategy. I'm eager to even even though I'm bruised. Still, with Google Glass, I'm eager to try. And your experience, I want to hear more now, but I think the three tier strategy is smart and there for you to explain that and for me to explain it.

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Jason Howell
Yeah. I mean, you know, they basically and by the way, I do have a video on my YouTube channel, which is kind of like a whole walkthrough of, of everything, that I saw that, that I was allowed to take, footage of and everything like that. And I, you know, I have an update on my Substack where I write about it and everything.

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Jason Howell
I went, I went full board. It was a very busy weekend. But, so they basically showed off, like two glasses, Astra glasses, which are kind of we've got the, the meta, like Ray-Bans and the, you know, that level of eye glasses, which is no screen. And then we've got the screen version. This is the monocular version that I'm getting in the video right now, which is one display.

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Jason Howell
Every once in a while, you can kind of catch a little glimpse of what the display looks like. Depending on where I'm looking, you can kind of see, yeah.

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Jeff Jarvis
I'll just give you kind of a it gives you a googly eyed look. It looks right. It yeah.

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Jason Howell
It looks very science fiction when they start flashing in. But so there's the astro glasses, which are the step up from just audio glasses. Right. And so you do have a display. There's a little interactive capability there. Then you've got the new hardware that they showed off, which is kind of the in-between point between that and full on like VR headset, huge gear that you, you know, that you go fully immersive on.

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Jason Howell
That is, project, what do they call it, project Aura, which is a collaboration with X real, which is a company that's doing really cool things in wired glasses and stuff like that. I've actually got a, got some, actual hardware on the way that I'm going to be reviewing unrelated to this. And then you've got the Galaxy XR style VR headset, which is the large form factor, fully immersive, you know, very expensive.

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Jason Howell
And so, yeah, I think Google's what Google was really laying out here is we've created this platform, Android XR, that works seamlessly across all of these different types of devices and whatever other devices come down the road that we haven't, you know, revealed yet. So there's probably more form factors and stuff, but I do I do think that they're doing you know, doing some great things.

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Jason Howell
Learning lessons from Google Glass 13 years ago, however long that was. And you know, the the platform is capable now of supporting all of this. The AI integration is really, finds a really comfortable home here. Like they they work really well together. These two very, you know, specific use cases. Yeah. It's just it's kind of an interesting moment where, okay, I could see this working whether people want it is the question.

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Jason Howell
I think that's that remains to be the question, you know.

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Jeff Jarvis
Well so so again it has one level is camera and sound. Only one level is that plus on screen. And then one level is headset right.

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Jason Howell
Yeah.

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Jeff Jarvis
And so yeah what that means is that they have the market opportunity to find out what people want. As you just said, whereas Meta's now you know, so so far it's just had the sound and and camera which is fine. It made it a, a doable product that people could buy and try and play. But I think is very smart by Google.

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Jeff Jarvis
I think as is the case for Google and Android, it's a platform play in their way. Yeah. So the next question is what do you think, Jason? Who's in the better position to, and pull back for a second open? We don't know what open AI is going to do. So that's it's probably not glasses is what we're hearing, right?

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Jeff Jarvis
It's not a phone. So put them aside. Apple still not clear at all on this world right. Really.

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Jason Howell
Right. I mean they have their Apple Vision Pro right. Which is this really freaking expensive headset. Very very different caliber.

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Jeff Jarvis
So if you just look at meta versus Google, as a platform as as manufacturers saying, yeah, I'll, I'll build for that. And right now meta just has, what, two glass glasses manufacturers who are doing this.

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Jason Howell
Yeah, Ray-Ban and Oakley. Right, right.

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Jeff Jarvis
So the question is will all the Samsungs of the world will others build on one of these platforms? That to me is the key to whether or not it's going to be successful. And it's not just that, oh gee, the hardware is nice or the formula's nice, the technology is nice. It also it has to fit into a larger, ecosystem.

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Jeff Jarvis
Right.

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Jason Howell
100%. I mean, I'm inclined to believe that Google is in a much stronger position as far as this is concerned. They've proven themselves with the Android operating system on smartphones, and Android XR is essentially an extension of that. And they're basically saying what we did on smartphones, let's do it for extended reality devices. Why is that a like a true kind of benefit for Google, where it isn't as much for meta?

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Jason Howell
Meta's proven a lot as far as all this is concerned there Oculus or sorry, not. I still fall into the trap of calling it Oculus, but their quest headsets and stuff have definitely been kind of a definitive VR headset approach for mass consumers who are interested in this sort of stuff, which is still a very small pool. Right.

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Jason Howell
But what Google has that I think meta doesn't have. And and my trip to Google last weekend or last week was a prime illustration of this is because they were they were really messaging it hard is just the fact that if you are an Android developer and you are developing an app for Android full stop, it's going to work with Android XR and what you get out of Android XR from that app is actually pretty appealing.

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Jason Howell
Like, it's not like, you know, I was wearing the the Astor glasses, which is just the little displays in front either monocular one display or binocular two or whatever. And they were showing like YouTube music, for example. They said YouTube music has not been there's not been any code added to the YouTube music app specific to this headset.

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Jason Howell
And yet this is what you get out of the box, because what they're tapping into, and it was very visually rich. The player came up it it looked like it was made for the glasses. This is my point. And so with no extra effort on the part of the developers, you end up getting, you developed your app for the phone.

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Jason Howell
You end up getting an app experience that works really well as a baseline in XR. And then if you see that as a developer and you go, oh, well, I can make that even better if I just put in these lines of code, you know what I mean? It's like a foundation to build on and boom, right out of the gate, you get all this support and that's something that I just don't know that meta has.

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Jeff Jarvis
So now we're going to have to do more work. You have the entirety of Android apps one. You have your life in the Google ecosystem to your Gmail and your and your contacts and all that kind of stuff coming up. Right. Matter. Right. And your maps and all that, to, you have the manufacturer relationships that Google has already.

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Jeff Jarvis
Yeah. Yeah, I think it's. Yeah, totally. I think it sounds like.

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Jason Howell
Yeah, it does. And you have the strength and you have the strength. The strength, I believe of Gemini, you know, in all of the Bull.

00:12:42:20 - 00:12:43:19
Jeff Jarvis
Bell.

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Jason Howell
Witch.

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Jeff Jarvis
Right.

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Jason Howell
You know, I have the Oakleys somewhere, the meta oakleys. And let's just say that the meta AI that I use inside the oakleys is far, behind in my experience, it's not nearly as useful as what I expect out of Gemini from experience using it. You know.

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Jeff Jarvis
When, little question first, monocular binocular, that's how do you how do you how do you, control that?

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Jason Howell
What do you mean? How do you.

00:13:12:29 - 00:13:15:29
Jeff Jarvis
You say I just one on one eye, or does it depend on the application or.

00:13:15:29 - 00:13:18:16
Jason Howell
No, it's no, it's it's hardware specific. So there it.

00:13:18:16 - 00:13:18:26
Jeff Jarvis
Is.

00:13:18:26 - 00:13:36:25
Jason Howell
There was there was a prototype that they had that only had one display that was the monocular. The monocular prototype. They had another prototype that did have a display in each eye. That was the binocular version that added stereoscopic depth, that added a wider field of view, though not super.

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Jeff Jarvis
Okay. So let me let me probe that for a second. Obviously you're not going to go walking down the street with a button camera, right?

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Jason Howell
Well, you could absolutely. As long as those displays aren't lit up.

00:13:47:13 - 00:13:54:11
Jeff Jarvis
And now I know that. But if what if they're lit up? You're not going to go anywhere. You're you're doing it for viewing.

00:13:54:14 - 00:13:55:03
Jason Howell
Yeah.

00:13:55:04 - 00:13:58:27
Jeff Jarvis
There was you're not looking at to if I want a map.

00:13:59:00 - 00:14:05:12
Jason Howell
So I can walk. So they showed off was that was maps in the final ocular with binocular really.

00:14:05:14 - 00:14:08:01
Jeff Jarvis
And you could still see where you're walking.

00:14:08:03 - 00:14:26:29
Jason Howell
Yeah. I mean it is a see through display. So I like that. But it's the same thing with tracking. No it is no. Believe me it is distracting. I don't know that I would feel comfortable with it. Almost certainly people are going to do it and they're going to feel comfortable with it. I don't know how comfortable I would I would be with that, but time will tell.

00:14:26:29 - 00:14:54:07
Jason Howell
Maybe I will be. They did say that they're building in hooks, at least into maps. Maps, as the example they said, we are taking in a lot of, signals, you know, be it spatial or it, be it, localization and other technology, you know, recognizing through onboard sensors or whatever, where you are to be able to disable the display at critical times.

00:14:54:09 - 00:15:16:13
Jason Howell
And so the example of what I had asked is like, if I'm, if I'm out on the street walking around with one of these, following a map, and I enter the crosswalk, does the display stay on or does it go away because like, that sounds very dangerous. And they said, no, our technology will understand that you're walking into a crosswalk and it can pull off the display.

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Jeff Jarvis
Oh yeah. So all right, one more question.

00:15:22:05 - 00:15:43:20
Jeff Jarvis
Your stationary. You just want to watch videos. Sure. You use the binocular. How good is that experience. Obviously I imagine that the the full hood yeah is a better experience. But how how would you watch videos that way versus you have your, your laptop around.

00:15:43:23 - 00:16:09:07
Jason Howell
Yeah. I, I, I would depending on the circumstance like when I, so they, they put on the binocular, version of the astro glasses and then they put on Super Mario Brothers movie, but the 3D version of it because I had two different displays. And yeah, it looked pretty good. Is it as good as, like a screen that you can't see through?

00:16:09:08 - 00:16:32:18
Jason Howell
No. Like there's still a little bit of that, but where I think I would totally do that is on an airplane. Absolutely. I would do that on an airplane because I get the benefit of the 3D if I care about that. I'm not 100% blocked off from my environment. So if the, you know, the the person walks down the aisle and asks me if I want some peanuts, right.

00:16:32:18 - 00:16:54:18
Jason Howell
It's not like, I don't know. They are they're it's a very low profile thing. They're just glasses. Yeah. And so I would totally do that. Absolutely. And I think it's also a darker environment. Right. Like where I was testing this, it was a very bright room and I could still see it. And when I was watching it I was like, you know, I could see myself doing this if the situation was right.

00:16:54:20 - 00:17:02:26
Jason Howell
I could still sort of see through the video that was there enough to know what's on the other side, but not so much that way. I see what was on the screen.

00:17:03:03 - 00:17:05:26
Jeff Jarvis
So what do you think is the timing for release of these things?

00:17:05:29 - 00:17:09:27
Jason Howell
Well, they they basically said a lot of next year, you know, okay.

00:17:09:27 - 00:17:12:17
Jeff Jarvis
But not, not 27.

00:17:12:19 - 00:17:39:26
Jason Howell
No, I mean he Justin did say 20, 26 is going to be a big year. But just wait for 2027. We've got some really cool things planned. So there's that. All right. You got to, got to put out the little breadcrumb trail to keep you excited. But, the my understanding is the monocular version of the Astro glasses are a developer preview right now.

00:17:39:26 - 00:18:04:09
Jason Howell
I think they had told me when I went through the demo that like these will be available as developer preview, right for developers immediately once we do the thing. So I'm guessing we're going to start seeing those seated out into the hands of developers. And then, you know, I mean, if I had to guess sometime middle of next year, we might finally be able to get our heads inside of the Astro version.

00:18:04:12 - 00:18:23:11
Jason Howell
Now, the project Aura, which is the in between that and the full on you know, immersive experience that you're going a Galaxy XR that they also said, next year, 2026 I'm guessing end of year for that, you know? Yeah, that would be my guess. I don't have any specific info on that.

00:18:23:11 - 00:18:27:23
Jeff Jarvis
But do you think any of this has any impact on the Google Watch plus or minus on.

00:18:27:23 - 00:18:29:11
Jason Howell
The on the watch?

00:18:29:12 - 00:18:32:14
Jeff Jarvis
Did they show anybody using a watch with it? Now?

00:18:32:17 - 00:18:52:16
Jason Howell
No. Member. Did I see any sort of interaction between the watch and the glasses? I don't remember seeing that. Definitely with the phone. There was there was one time with the glasses, the astro glasses, where Justin was standing in the room, and I asked him to throw a peace sign, and I took a picture handsfree. I didn't have a phone in my hands.

00:18:52:16 - 00:19:09:22
Jason Howell
I took it with the glasses, and then I immediately asked it to put him in a field of daisies, and it threw it to nano banana and like five seconds later in my glasses, know I didn't touch anything. And five seconds later there was a little preview of him standing in a field of daisies. I was like, I don't know how practical that is.

00:19:09:22 - 00:19:14:16
Jason Howell
I don't know how many times I've got to totally do that, you know, in my daily life. But that was a pretty cool demo.

00:19:14:17 - 00:19:16:06
Jeff Jarvis
You could then email it.

00:19:16:08 - 00:19:37:22
Jason Howell
Right? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, totally. And it all gets saved on your phone. Uploaded, conceivably uploaded to your your Google Photos library in the cloud automatically if that's what your settings are set to, which mine are. Yeah. Interesting. And both both versions get saved. Not just the nano banana version. So. Right, right. It was pretty cool, I gotta say.

00:19:37:24 - 00:19:37:26
Jason Howell
And.

00:19:37:27 - 00:19:40:17
Jeff Jarvis
No, no price point, right?

00:19:40:20 - 00:20:01:13
Jason Howell
No price point. But you know, when we think of Galaxy XR being, you know, what is that 1819 somewhere around there, I can't remember exactly what it is. 1900, let's say 1800, you know, so then we work backwards from there is the X real, which is a lesser version of that probably going to be less expensive than the full thing.

00:20:01:13 - 00:20:18:00
Jason Howell
Yeah, probably. So what 1500 is that, 1500. I'm totally guessing. Astro glasses. Step back from that. You know, binocular is that 1200 monocular? Is that a thousand? Yeah, I don't know what it is, but somewhere in that range sounds doable.

00:20:18:00 - 00:20:33:16
Jeff Jarvis
Yeah. And I think I, I haven't really debated getting the, the better ones. I think the monocular would, would grab me again. Because I think I'd use it less for viewing things and more for information and connection.

00:20:33:16 - 00:20:56:08
Jason Howell
I, I mean the monocular is if you connected with glass back in the day. Right. You'll connect with that like it's, it really is that but done but much better in my. Yeah much better in my opinion. Night sky in our chat says what about privacy from others knowing what you are viewing? Yeah. Don't don't expect privacy on what you're viewing.

00:20:56:11 - 00:21:13:29
Jason Howell
I mean, if you're connected with Bluetooth, other people aren't going to hear it. But if you're listening through the glasses, people are going to hear it. And as you saw, if you're watching the live stream in the video version, when you're watching something, you can see from the outside that somebody is watching something, it's not totally invisible.

00:21:13:29 - 00:21:14:24
Jeff Jarvis
There's I think it's fine.

00:21:14:24 - 00:21:23:13
Jason Howell
Screen in front of you. That's good. I think that's okay. I mean, that that's a signal that sells someone on the other end. Hey, you know, there there is a layer between us.

00:21:23:13 - 00:21:45:12
Jeff Jarvis
Well, there's the norm. You know, I these days, I don't run into many people who who are wearing watches, Google or Apple. And it's it's funny. It feels like it's it's less hot that it was I don't know what the sales are like, but I just I just see it less often. But it's that moment when, when when they came out, I got used to people looking at their watch and not thinking that they were bored with me and wondering what time it was.

00:21:45:15 - 00:21:46:04
Jason Howell
Yeah, they were.

00:21:46:05 - 00:22:06:13
Jeff Jarvis
They may have been, but they were looking at a message on the on the on the watch. All right. So whether you pick up the phone or look at the watch, this is different. If it just pops into your eye and gone, I think that's an improvement in our norms. I can still be staring, apparently, at you, even though my focus is now on on this.

00:22:06:16 - 00:22:23:13
Jason Howell
Yeah, I think there is a little. Yeah. But at the same time, like when you're doing that, like you do like, I don't know how to how to phrase it, but my face looks different when I'm looking in your eyes versus when I'm looking at a thing that's in between our eyes, you know?

00:22:23:18 - 00:22:24:20
Jeff Jarvis
And I guess, you.

00:22:24:20 - 00:22:40:24
Jason Howell
Know, again, touching back on what we said looked like just a minute ago, you being on the other end of that, you're going to see that little flashing screen in my eyes. So you're going to know that there's something in between us. So kind of sort of. But, you know, it kind of faces the same issue, which is I know you're not connected to me because I can see it.

00:22:40:26 - 00:22:42:11
Jeff Jarvis
That's okay.

00:22:42:13 - 00:22:43:05
Jason Howell
Yeah.

00:22:43:07 - 00:23:10:25
Jeff Jarvis
The other thing for me personally is that I'm getting my cataracts done in January. That me it looks the old Google Glass. I spent a fortune getting special lenses for the damn thing. Yeah, because that prescription lenses. I will now go forward. Where I will, be able to just plain old use regular lenses in it. So that reduces my cost and complication considerably.

00:23:10:27 - 00:23:14:14
Jeff Jarvis
But here's a little question. Do you wear contacts? Right.

00:23:14:17 - 00:23:15:17
Jason Howell
Yeah. We're contacts.

00:23:15:17 - 00:23:19:12
Jeff Jarvis
What about are they distance or reading? Both. How are they work?

00:23:19:14 - 00:23:26:06
Jason Howell
They are mostly, distance. I'm. I'm very nearsighted.

00:23:26:09 - 00:23:37:09
Jeff Jarvis
Did you hear anything about how these things operate? If you are, if you're, not nearsighted and need help for reading, is this close enough for reading, or does this act like it's it's distance?

00:23:37:12 - 00:23:58:24
Jason Howell
I wish I had asked that I didn't I didn't ask that. I didn't really hear much about that. I mean, I do know that leading into the week, or the the demo event, they asked me for my prescription if I had one because they could get special lenses. So it'll be possible to do these with lenses for people who require them, for sure.

00:23:58:26 - 00:24:21:05
Jason Howell
But I don't know what that looks like to be a broad scale and not from personal experience. I would I would be interested, with the ex-real, with the project or, because that's more blocked off, you know, when you're really focusing on the almost entirely on these near displays, I wonder for myself, if I wasn't wearing contacts and being very nearsighted, would I still be able to focus on that?

00:24:21:05 - 00:24:39:17
Jason Howell
Yeah, you know what I mean. And I and I get that question a lot on, on some of my reviews of the, the rainbow glasses, which I don't have in in reach right now, but is kind of along the lines of the actual, aura glasses that they showed. And I need to pop my contacts out and take a look and see because I haven't really tested that.

00:24:39:17 - 00:24:47:01
Jeff Jarvis
So I'm so glad you got invited to this and are getting these things because it's important for a fun audience. You can give these full reports. Thank you.

00:24:47:03 - 00:25:11:05
Jason Howell
Yeah, it's enjoyable and I'm getting I'm continually getting more and more excited about this aspect of technology. And at the same time, I'm starting to get really contacted by a lot of the manufacturers of these, not just the big players, but some of the other ones too. So I'm starting to get in some hardware so I can really go deeper on comparing and everything, because I think this is an interesting trend to keep following.

00:25:11:11 - 00:25:45:29
Jason Howell
So does meta, by the way. Who hook meta. You know how they named their company, after the metaverse? They went from Facebook to Meta. Well, apparently they are going in the opposite direction from Google right now, leaning away instead of leaning in. According to Business Insider. Anyways, they are, they're mixed reality glasses, codenamed Phoenix, are getting pushed back from the second half of 2026 to the first half of 2027.

00:25:46:02 - 00:26:08:21
Jason Howell
You know, this would be glasses with a little wired puck as power. I don't know if that's compute and battery or just compute or just battery or whatever. And then at the same time, Bloomberg had reported that, Zuckerberg sent out an internal memo or something along those lines, slashing it with plans to slash its metaverse.

00:26:08:21 - 00:26:31:04
Jason Howell
So maybe it's not even memo stage yet. Maybe this is just they're looking towards the future, the next couple of months, and they want to potentially slash their metaverse budget by up to 30%, including some layoffs associated to that. So, you know, does this indicate a general kind of like consumer lack of interest in these things?

00:26:31:06 - 00:26:57:02
Jeff Jarvis
I don't know. Well, also a strategic issue, he's putting tons of money into AI and yes, that's where the fight is. And he knows what's what the fight is. And I think he was premature in making the whole company meta. Way premature. It's a story that didn't end up the rundown. That line 51 that says that there is a the superstars of AI he's hired are now in eternal conflict.

00:26:57:05 - 00:27:26:05
Jeff Jarvis
Eli Tannen from the New York Times, with, the executives inside. Meta. So, you have, Alexander Wang, the very high priced hire that they did, who's now, fighting with, Chris Cox, the head of product, and Andrew Bosworth, the CTO. Cox and Bosworth are still thinking and meta terms and saying, well, you should be doing this stuff to benefit Instagram and Facebook and so on.

00:27:26:12 - 00:27:51:24
Jeff Jarvis
And Wang is saying that deck with them. So it's not just my point is, it's not just that meta as a metaverse strategy may be, getting the back seat even looks like there's going to be a fight as to whether or not the existing products Facebook, Instagram, and company, stay front seat or backseat. So it's a company in some turmoil?

00:27:51:26 - 00:28:16:27
Jason Howell
Yeah. Trying to figure out what where it places its emphasis in its focus. You know, because when when Zuckerberg changed changed the company name to meta around metaverse, it felt strange. Maybe. Maybe it becomes one of those things is similar to like, Google last. Maybe it was just ahead of its time. You know what I mean?

00:28:17:00 - 00:28:17:09
Jeff Jarvis
Yeah.

00:28:17:09 - 00:28:30:29
Jason Howell
Something that eventually proves itself and it just it may have seemed like the right time to Zuckerberg then, but it really wasn't. All of the things hadn't come together. And maybe five years down the line there, like, see, it was long game.

00:28:31:01 - 00:28:51:28
Jeff Jarvis
Yeah. But the but the potential okay. So so even if Zuckerberg could say we were there first and we were the best at it, it's still AI is the winning game now. Yeah. And the stock market. And meanwhile there's more talk inside meta that they're going to walk away from open source and go toward, closed source models and all that.

00:28:52:00 - 00:29:12:04
Jeff Jarvis
So he's really trying to figure out what to do. And it's fascinating to me. You know, last week we talked about how the recent weeks we talked about how Google and Gemini have just leapt ahead of everybody in perception. I think they were farther ahead than anybody would have emitted. But now you have both open AI. Another, how about a habit of hammering against what Google's doing?

00:29:12:07 - 00:29:19:19
Jeff Jarvis
And it's really interesting to see how quick this switch and Google can lose it just as quickly. But right now they're, they're they're running the race ahead.

00:29:19:22 - 00:29:48:20
Jason Howell
Yeah. Yeah I think my my overall kind of walk away from this, this news and you know, particularly my visit to Google was just a re it a I've, I've firmly believed for a while now that I and XR are two technologies that are incredibly complementary and stand to benefit a lot from each other. What I saw on Friday seems to confirm that for me on a deeper level.

00:29:48:22 - 00:29:56:06
Jason Howell
Again, I think the big question is whether people actually want that or not. And that's going to have, you know, only time will tell on that. Yeah.

00:29:56:09 - 00:30:28:14
Jeff Jarvis
But yeah, well, you know, as you talk about I was at an event the other night in New York called humans of the loop, which is mainly journalists coming in. And, Amy Rinehart, who an AI person at the Associated Press asked John Borthwick, the the guest. Are you on the Yann LeCun bias? So it's become that clear now and since, real world model and experiential is the paradigm where I think it goes, I'm even wondering whether the glasses have an impact on that.

00:30:28:16 - 00:30:46:15
Jeff Jarvis
Does is there is there a whole new range of data about how things operate in the world and how people move in it, and so on? That comes from glasses like this, that in turn trains AI. Now, obviously you can't leave the glasses on all the time and people are not going to want their lives uploaded for training.

00:30:46:17 - 00:30:56:12
Jeff Jarvis
However, one can imagine this as, a potential source of new modeling data.

00:30:56:14 - 00:30:57:16
Jason Howell
100%.

00:30:57:16 - 00:30:58:05
Jeff Jarvis
Which could be some.

00:30:58:05 - 00:31:02:22
Jason Howell
People are going to be okay with that. Yeah, we can be like, heck yeah. Like I want to contribute, you know, do you.

00:31:02:22 - 00:31:23:15
Jeff Jarvis
Want to train the model right? Right. Yeah. I you know, I could even see it going too far, but it's almost like mechanical Turk, mechanical human. The demo that the Yann LeCun gives is a video going around the room and asking the computer to understand how many chairs are in it. And I could almost see this is going wacky here, but let's just play with it for a second.

00:31:23:21 - 00:31:48:01
Jeff Jarvis
And so I see your, you get to rent your own time. You're sitting there and you're looking at a scene. Just imagine this. And the computer doesn't understand something. Can the computer ask you right in those moments can you train the computer. Hey, I see that there's how many chairs are there in that room? Jeff, I trust that you can count them.

00:31:48:03 - 00:31:52:13
Jeff Jarvis
And look over here. Is that a chair or is that, you know, a sculpture?

00:31:52:13 - 00:31:59:17
Jason Howell
What? Is that interesting? Yeah, you're totally right. You're going down the captcha road. Yeah. How? They use CAPTCHAs to to inform.

00:31:59:17 - 00:32:02:09
Jeff Jarvis
But not as a not as obnoxious one hopes and they.

00:32:02:11 - 00:32:03:26
Jason Howell
Say that's dangerous.

00:32:03:28 - 00:32:14:28
Jeff Jarvis
Right. Maybe this is where you learn. So this is going wacky, but it's kind of fun to imagine that, that the training in the real world takes on new, potential scope.

00:32:15:00 - 00:32:18:12
Jason Howell
Yeah. Kind of fun. Yeah, yeah. Very fun. All right.

00:32:18:15 - 00:32:21:03
Jeff Jarvis
Back to back to reality.

00:32:21:06 - 00:32:28:25
Jason Howell
Let's see here. Yeah. Less. Less in, like, fun, news.

00:32:28:27 - 00:32:32:14
Jeff Jarvis
Unless you're just long. Yeah, this is fun. This is.

00:32:32:17 - 00:32:59:12
Jason Howell
Hilarious. Wow. We are already at, 30 minutes, and we're only getting to the second story. Nvidia now allowed to sell. It's very powerful, but not the most powerful, chips to China. So this would be the 200 AI chips. U.S. President Donald Trump has reversed some of the US chip export, rules that had had tightened down around this.

00:32:59:14 - 00:33:25:18
Jason Howell
However, it it does include a 25% surcharge that I think goes to Seiko to the US government saying, yes, you can do this. I wouldn't be surprised. And customers must be approved. I don't know exactly the details on the approval process. It sounds like, of course, the US government would be part of that process. Also, I'm imagining some of that on the on the Chinese side as well.

00:33:25:23 - 00:33:39:03
Jason Howell
But, yeah, this. What do you think about this? Is this about, like, keeping keeping companies that are inside China like Weiwei, from suddenly dominating as a result of the restrictions?

00:33:39:06 - 00:34:07:19
Jeff Jarvis
I think it's almost the opposite. I think that that that that the export restrictions are hurting the American companies too much. And Jensen Huang has done a, a lot of sucking up to the white House and Trump publicly and privately, to say that you're hurting us and we need this. So it was a big gift to Nvidia by Trump to say, yes, you can start exporting these things now.

00:34:07:22 - 00:34:24:15
Jeff Jarvis
Trump also said that we're going to do the same thing for Intel on our wonderful American companies, other American companies. So that's okay. Now, the other question is, will the Chinese want them? It's not just going to say, you know, take your stick and chips. We can build this stuff on our own, in our own ways.

00:34:24:15 - 00:34:45:02
Jeff Jarvis
I think that's the whole point of Deep Seek was to say, look at what we could do without them. And, and China can still rush ahead. So I think it's true that if we cut off China entirely, we would only have strengthened Chinese technology and chips for sure. So I think, I think I believe this had to be done.

00:34:45:04 - 00:34:53:24
Jeff Jarvis
I think this was an important move. It wasn't just sucking up to a technology company. It's it's necessary for American technology to make it competitive globally.

00:34:53:27 - 00:35:27:05
Jason Howell
Well, and as we know, technology finds a way. And all right, meanwhile, there's been a whole lot of chip smuggling going on. Apparently, U.S. Department of Justice, apparently detained two people who were allegedly smuggling Nvidia's advanced H100 chips. Also 200 AI chips into China. Then we've got deep sea COO. You mentioned the the information reporting. That deep Seac is secretly training its next big model on smuggled Blackwell GPUs.

00:35:27:08 - 00:35:43:03
Jason Howell
Nvidia says you know, they're pushing back on that. They say we we've seen no credible evidence of such. They called it phantom data centers, which I just loved. I love so much I like put it in the doc is like a title suggestion. Never heard that one before, but I.

00:35:43:03 - 00:35:44:23
Jeff Jarvis
Like Phantom Twin.

00:35:44:25 - 00:36:10:29
Jason Howell
Yeah. And then we've got Nvidia also reportedly developing a software based location verification system for its GPUs that would enable them to estimate where chips are actually running, essentially tracking their use around the globe, creating a tool that, could potentially curb some of this smuggling that apparently is happening.

00:36:11:02 - 00:36:15:27
Jeff Jarvis
So, yeah, I mean, I wonder what happens if.

00:36:15:29 - 00:36:19:07
Jeff Jarvis
It just opened up the trade entirely.

00:36:19:09 - 00:36:19:23
Jason Howell
Yeah.

00:36:19:23 - 00:36:25:13
Jeff Jarvis
What do you what's really what's really been gained by keeping black walls back from China? I don't think much at all.

00:36:25:15 - 00:36:57:13
Jason Howell
Yeah. Yeah. I mean, that is a really good question and a really good point. I agree, I would tend to agree. With that, I wonder what would happen though, like the, you know, I think the US administration there trying in every way, shape or form to prove that like America is, is the greatest and we've got the biggest and the best, and everyone else should not benefit off of our, our technology and our work because it's ours, mine, mine, mine.

00:36:57:16 - 00:37:06:18
Jason Howell
And I don't I don't know, maybe, maybe if it opens up, maybe that it's proven that that's not true or I don't know.

00:37:06:20 - 00:37:14:08
Jeff Jarvis
Yeah. Or every time we restrict China, we only advance them in one other part of the, the realm so that they can before you force them on hold.

00:37:14:10 - 00:37:21:07
Jason Howell
Off for them. Yeah. Yeah. To to figure their way around it. Right. Because AI's global know hands away. There's no.

00:37:21:07 - 00:37:24:22
Jeff Jarvis
Way around. It's global. So how do we act like that?

00:37:24:25 - 00:37:47:15
Jason Howell
Yeah. Yeah. It it's close minded thinking I, I completely agree. Well, very, very interesting stuff. And I'm, I'm grateful that we get to talk about it each and every week on this show. Part of the reason that we're able to talk about it is because we have amazing fans, amazing people who support us on this show each and every week on our Patreon.

00:37:47:15 - 00:37:58:08
Jason Howell
That's Patreon. Uncommon side show fans like Joe Esposito. What's up Joe? Yeah. Joe, sorry, I'm covering your your face there.

00:37:58:11 - 00:37:59:15
Jeff Jarvis
It's gorgeous.

00:37:59:18 - 00:38:22:01
Jason Howell
Kilroy I know once the lower third starts stacking, it starts covering up. Jeff. And we don't want that. Joe wrote code and another Joe. Joe. Stir. Tyrannus. Siren us. I hope I got that right. Just a few of our amazing patrons who support us each and every week, month on the show. We could not do this show without you.

00:38:22:04 - 00:38:31:09
Jason Howell
And we appreciate your support. Patreon.com slash I inside show. Thank you for being there for us. We do appreciate it.

00:38:31:11 - 00:39:01:12
Jason Howell
Okay, we're going to take a quick break and, thank the sponsor of this episode because I'm thrilled to announce we actually kind of had their first read on, just a couple of days ago. Your 360 and your 360, I you may remember, you know, just, last week, I think I mentioned on the show that I had Jared Guralnick, CEO and founder of year 360 on the YouTube channel to demo the product.

00:39:01:14 - 00:39:13:23
Jason Howell
I found it very compelling, personally enough so that I'm actually going through it myself. Jeff is going to be one of my, my 360 deliverers. So it might be a little biased, but, nonetheless, I'm curious to see.

00:39:13:23 - 00:39:17:14
Jeff Jarvis
I do I do call Jason boss all the time, so it's good.

00:39:17:17 - 00:39:37:04
Jason Howell
You do. It feels a little weird, but. But it's okay. I. I'm okay with that. More to report that on that as I go along here, but here's the thing that's really stuck with me about this lack of career development is the number one reason people quit a job. And yet most of us have never gotten feedback.

00:39:37:04 - 00:40:11:18
Jason Howell
That's good enough to actually act on. And your 360 does something that wasn't very possible even like six months ago. It uses his voice AI to have real conversations with you and your colleagues, just 15 to 20 minutes each, and that AI is probing for specifics about you. And then it takes all that. It synthesizes it, and then walks you through the findings in a coaching conversation so you can get a real clear idea of, you know, how these how all of these people feel about you.

00:40:11:18 - 00:40:34:27
Jason Howell
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00:40:35:04 - 00:40:59:14
Jason Howell
That's your 360 data AI code inside to get 10% off through the month of January 2026. And just a huge thank you to your 360 AI for sponsoring this episode of the AI Inside Podcast. We are absolutely thrilled to have them on board, so it's great to have you here. All right. And with that, we're going to take a quick break.

00:40:59:14 - 00:41:07:04
Jason Howell
And then on the other side of the break, we've got, an alliance in a genetic AI alliance to talk about that's coming up.

00:41:07:06 - 00:41:49:17
Jason Howell
I saw this news and I was like, okay, this is pretty interesting stuff. We have a new alliance for agents. It's called the a genetic AI Foundation, open AI anthropic and Block all backing it to start. And the purpose here is to keep the AI agent ecosystem from becoming just a big, massive, massive, splintered ness and fragmented silos and all that kind of stuff basically make it so that the agents can work together and across different, you know, all of these different platforms and services and everything speak the same language, I guess, it open source is the plumbing behind the scenes for AI agents.

00:41:49:20 - 00:42:14:10
Jason Howell
And we've talked a lot in the past about anthropic model, context protocol, MCP. That's part of this open AI is agents.md spec blocks goose agent framework, which I'm less familiar with, but nonetheless. There you go. All of them are a part of this, and in fact, they're all donating those technologies to the effort as a part of the standardization stack.

00:42:14:10 - 00:42:31:28
Jason Howell
So those projects are now going to live under Linux Foundation governance. Anthropic is not going to have, you know, sole control over MCP anymore. It's just kind of part of this big collective bucket. And I mean, that sounds good to me. I don't know, what do you think, Jeff?

00:42:32:01 - 00:42:51:04
Jeff Jarvis
Yeah. And we had an interview with Microsoft, what, three weeks ago, I think. Now. Yes. Where they are also trying to bring some sense to the agent world by, giving them ID cards, basically. I think that's important. I think two things about this. One is it's not a it's not a standard until everybody signs up to it.

00:42:51:04 - 00:42:58:23
Jeff Jarvis
So we do need to hear whether Google's there. And, Microsoft does a come along with open AI at this point.

00:42:58:25 - 00:43:02:07
Jason Howell
Microsoft I do not believe Google. Yes. Other members.

00:43:02:14 - 00:43:03:29
Jeff Jarvis
Google has already

00:43:04:02 - 00:43:12:13
Jason Howell
Yeah. That's my understanding. Google Amazon AWS, Bloomberg, Cloudflare. Those are a few of the other names that I saw that I.

00:43:12:16 - 00:43:30:04
Jeff Jarvis
I didn't know there was. So there's a little bit more. It's okay. That's very good. So then it comes to being a standard. The other issue that strikes me is I remember back in the day, you know, we were talking about spaces. There was name space on the internet. And there's kind of a web space. And agents are their own space.

00:43:30:04 - 00:43:48:16
Jeff Jarvis
There are, you know, a dimension in this thing. And so they they're going to need, protocols and standards, to be able to operate properly. And I think it's a good thing if they get together at the beginning and recognize that their agents are going to have to talk to everybody else's agents, and you can't really have a closed agent tech world that doesn't work.

00:43:48:18 - 00:43:55:16
Jeff Jarvis
You've got to be able to work with others. So I think good.

00:43:55:19 - 00:44:22:13
Jason Howell
Yeah. And does it matter where an agent starts like obviously all these companies you know I'm sure anthropic wants to capture as many users as possible. ChatGPT OpenAI. They want the same thing. But if you've got an agent and it knows how to speak the same language as kind of your competing AI systems, is there something for everyone to benefit from having that agent on your system, integrating with your system, you know?

00:44:22:16 - 00:44:23:21
Jason Howell
Well, like.

00:44:23:23 - 00:44:54:07
Jeff Jarvis
It's interesting to figure the scale of this, you know, just generally, agents aside, AI as a whole, there's a lot of talk about about whether the web gets redesigned for that. There was a paper I saw this week, that tried to put forth standards around, maintaining data separately from pages, separately from what we think of as stories, in ways that are amenable to AI and agents.

00:44:54:09 - 00:45:10:15
Jeff Jarvis
So it changes that whole structure, number one. Number two, at some point we're all going to be making our own agents. We used to call them programs. We used to call them apps. But in a sense, now we're all going to be empowered to say, hey thing, go out there and do this for me.

00:45:10:17 - 00:45:11:16
Jason Howell
Do this for me.

00:45:11:21 - 00:45:29:23
Jeff Jarvis
So it's not going to it's I think the scale is boggling. Then, it may be coming from an agent factory that we kind of, sub contract to, you know, Google makes an Ice agent tool, and I use their tool to make the agent, but it's still my agent is going all over the web, and it's doing whatever I want.

00:45:29:26 - 00:45:47:29
Jeff Jarvis
And it's not according to the thing we know. It was the web. It's going to an agent world where it's intended to go agent to agent. And yeah, it never goes through a display space, such as the web space that was intended for human beings. It just ignores all that it says. I'm going to go straight to United Airlines and do this and come back, and there's no such thing as a website.

00:45:47:29 - 00:46:08:13
Jeff Jarvis
Then. Yeah. And then and then. So how do I know that my agent is going to speak well and act properly with all these other agents? Probably I'm going to have to use one of these companies platforms or protocols to, I don't want to say make it. I just want to instruct it to do that.

00:46:08:13 - 00:46:26:07
Jeff Jarvis
But there's going to be an unlimited number of agents out there going off and doing tasks. So the web kind of becomes a clearly and there's always been a subset of the internet, but now it becomes very clearly a smaller subset of the internet proportionately, I think, because there's this activity layer going on all the way around.

00:46:26:11 - 00:46:26:23
Jason Howell
Yeah.

00:46:26:23 - 00:46:39:17
Jeff Jarvis
So it's it's hard to get my head around. And I want to think more about this. But I think this is I MCP and this are good. Good. Step forward. Does it have a name? I forgot that this is.

00:46:39:19 - 00:46:45:22
Jason Howell
Yeah, it does. It is the, agent AI Foundation. Is that what you're talking about?

00:46:45:22 - 00:46:52:28
Jeff Jarvis
Right? Yes, yes, but I think like MCP, it probably needs a protocol name at some point. Or maybe it's a whole bunch of protocols they'll build.

00:46:52:28 - 00:46:53:22
Jason Howell
Yeah.

00:46:53:25 - 00:46:55:14
Jeff Jarvis
Yeah. For this.

00:46:55:16 - 00:47:12:25
Jason Howell
Yeah. The interesting I mean, this is also, you know, I'm sure kind of getting ahead of any regulatory pressure that might arise in this, in this regard to, you know, avoiding a scenario where they might be compelled to open up later versus now.

00:47:12:27 - 00:47:19:27
Jeff Jarvis
Well, they also have to create this kind of or they have to create this kind of neutral third party so that they're not accused of antitrust.

00:47:20:00 - 00:47:21:07
Jason Howell
Yeah, right.

00:47:21:09 - 00:47:36:02
Jeff Jarvis
That's what makes this that's why they're all going to run behind this because they're going to say, oh no, I'm not I'm not secretly talking to anthropic, says Google. Yeah the genetic foundation is doing that.

00:47:36:05 - 00:47:38:01
Jason Howell
Yep. So I think.

00:47:38:01 - 00:47:39:03
Jeff Jarvis
That's good news.

00:47:39:06 - 00:47:59:17
Jason Howell
Yeah I think it's, I think it's good news too. I think things like this are needed. I think it's interesting. You know what really caught my attention was oh and anthropic been you know getting a lot of praise. And I've seen a lot of, you know, support around MCP, for what it does and to see them be like, you know what?

00:47:59:19 - 00:48:03:14
Jason Howell
Here you go. It's part of this. Now, I think that's, that's a real step.

00:48:03:15 - 00:48:04:12
Jeff Jarvis
That's proper. Yep.

00:48:04:19 - 00:48:37:20
Jason Howell
Yeah, totally. Let's talk a little bit more about AI hardware. I realize we were earlier. But let's touch back in. This has nothing to do with XR. Has everything to do with just like AI wearables, let's say meta has acquired limitless. We definitely talked about limitless last year, I think when it was first being announced. It's a $99 little like AI pendant that you, I think, you wear around your neck kind of as a necklace sort of thing.

00:48:37:20 - 00:49:10:18
Jason Howell
One of those and it can record audio. It can transcribe conversations is probably capturing that audio on the device, sending it to your phone does the transcription everything. I think it carries a service fee for it. Through this deal. So Meta's acquiring the company, acquiring the technology. Limitless is going to stop selling the pendant immediately. Existing devices that are out there in the world will continue to work with the cloud services tied to them running for about another year.

00:49:10:21 - 00:49:29:17
Jason Howell
So you've got about a year of runway on that device. It was only $99. I suppose there's that, but that'll be a bummer for some people. However, the good news is, if you have this device, that year will be free unlimited. So everybody is moved to a free tier. No more paying on a monthly basis for all this stuff.

00:49:29:19 - 00:49:48:17
Jason Howell
So that's pretty sweet. And eventually that hardware and the team will basically be morphed into Meadow's own wearables roadmap. What that looks like, I don't know if they're going to make their own pendant and release it, or if this technology gets folded into something else at meta, but there you go.

00:49:48:19 - 00:50:09:26
Jeff Jarvis
And then meanwhile, we have Pebble. Remember them? They had a watch that was a, e-ink watch that was crowdfunded and much beloved at the time, but then went away. It's been resurrected. They have two watches out. This is an interesting small device. It's you're supposed to wear around your index finger. It has very simple. Has what? Yeah.

00:50:09:27 - 00:50:14:21
Jeff Jarvis
One button. I thought Jason would say wait, Jeff. No, no, he was he was he was illustrating.

00:50:14:21 - 00:50:15:29
Jason Howell
Demonstrating what index.

00:50:15:29 - 00:50:18:25
Jeff Jarvis
Finger looks like for those of you who may not know.

00:50:18:27 - 00:50:19:20
Jason Howell
Right.

00:50:19:22 - 00:50:45:28
Jeff Jarvis
So then you use your thumb, oh to push the little button on the little ring. And when you push it, it will, it will then do what you want it to do. So, it's not recording all the time. So not only that, but it is, just simply, then you're able to command your computer to do this or that to record something, and so on.

00:50:45:28 - 00:50:57:24
Jeff Jarvis
It runs on a hearing aid battery that is not replaceable. Yes, it's supposed to last two years. And so the idea is you just replace the thing every two years for 75 bucks.

00:50:57:26 - 00:51:12:13
Jason Howell
Yeah. And you can send it to them to recycle. Except as far as an e-waste is concerned, you send it to them, they take care of the recycling. It's not like they send you another ring when you send it in. If you want another one, you would buy it. But who the heck knows what they're going to be doing two years from now?

00:51:12:16 - 00:51:32:08
Jason Howell
And what I had seen is that the battery life. So two years is, is an interesting way to, to, to put it, because you don't know how much or how little someone's using it and it's a fixed battery. I think what I read is somewhere in the realm of 12 to 14 recorded hours total, which doesn't sound like a lot.

00:51:32:10 - 00:51:39:03
Jason Howell
However, it no, it doesn't, but this is not meant for long conversational stuff.

00:51:39:07 - 00:51:56:24
Jeff Jarvis
Yeah. This is here's what I can do. You can create or add a note. You can set a reminder. You can create an alarm, create a timer. You can pay play pause or skip music track. So unless you're going to do your novel this way right. Yeah. You're just going to say remind me to call mom.

00:51:56:27 - 00:52:21:01
Jason Howell
Yeah. Yeah. These short little blips. Right. Like one, two, three seconds. You know, and so to that end, when you talk about 12 to 14 hours or whatever it is, 10 to 12, I can't remember what it is somewhere in that area. Then it makes a little more sense. I just, I know that when I use voice recording for transcription and I, you know, contacts and all that kind of stuff, I tend to talk a lot.

00:52:21:04 - 00:52:24:08
Jeff Jarvis
So, yeah, because you got a whole note, you're, you're trying to remember it's not. Yes.

00:52:24:09 - 00:52:41:10
Jason Howell
It's called I figure the more yeah, I figured the more information I give it, the better off I am. And it's easy for me to talk a lot. So. So I don't want to over, like, I've got a couple of concerns about this, like phantom touches. If it's on my finger, I got my hand in my pocket.

00:52:41:10 - 00:52:59:27
Jason Howell
Is that button going to press down? I don't know, and I just burned through 30 minutes of my time. You know, that would kind of suck. I hope the button, you know, like, the ring looks interesting, but the button kind of has a kind of silicon kind of cheap quality to it. So I'm curious to see that in action in person.

00:52:59:27 - 00:53:01:11
Jason Howell
I did order one of these, by the way.

00:53:01:11 - 00:53:03:12
Jeff Jarvis
We did preorders only $75.

00:53:03:12 - 00:53:15:01
Jason Howell
So I was like, well, shoot, like I need help remembering things like this is actually really satisfies a need that I have. So I'm like, oh, well, for $75, I totally check it.

00:53:15:01 - 00:53:29:10
Jeff Jarvis
All right. Here's a question from our beginning of the show show, where you have the glasses. I presume you could also just tap or say, hey, my glasses do the same thing, right?

00:53:29:10 - 00:53:30:20
Jason Howell
Probably. So yeah.

00:53:30:23 - 00:53:43:17
Jeff Jarvis
So I wonder whether that gets the this the glasses preempt this. Yeah. So it's a little less. Well, I guess it's a little less obtrusive.

00:53:43:20 - 00:53:47:08
Jason Howell
There's something very tactile and immediate about like. Yeah.

00:53:47:10 - 00:53:51:09
Jeff Jarvis
As opposed to having to hit it, give a command to do something. Wait.

00:53:51:11 - 00:54:18:21
Jason Howell
Say the thing. It barks back to you. Did I get it right? Or, you know, the kind of conversational back and forth versus just boop done sends to my phone? Does this thing. Yeah. Another thing about this. There's no subscription price. Like, it's all the transcription is done on device. And so you aren't paying a monthly anything for this, which, by the way, I had also preordered the limitless pendant pendant that we just talked about back a year ago.

00:54:18:21 - 00:54:41:07
Jason Howell
When we first talked about it. I ended up canceling my preorder, over the summer because it kept getting delayed because I'm on Android. So basically, you know, I was second class titles and I just got tired of that. But I also kind of looked into the pricing of the subscription. I was like, I don't want to pay a monthly subscription to record voice notes like.

00:54:41:10 - 00:54:51:16
Jason Howell
And so when I saw this, I was like, oh, okay, sign me up. You know, $75, one fixed cost. I think once the preorders, start shipping it, it goes to 9999 in March.

00:54:51:16 - 00:54:59:15
Jeff Jarvis
Yeah, I should have added that. Yes, yes. Available in Polish, silver, Polish gold and matte black. Which one did you order, Jason?

00:54:59:18 - 00:55:04:19
Jason Howell
Strangely, because normally if I wear rings, it's silver. But I ordered the black one.

00:55:04:19 - 00:55:07:03
Jeff Jarvis
I think for this, that may seems right.

00:55:07:05 - 00:55:27:07
Jason Howell
Yeah. I mean, I like the, the ring part of the silver. I think that looks good. And if it was that the entire way, this just it's a weird contrast to me to have it be really shiny and nice and polished and that just looks really sharp. And then this just looks kind of cheap. Yeah, it does, you know what I mean?

00:55:27:09 - 00:55:34:11
Jason Howell
So I went with the black fairing. It would hide it a little bit but I don't know maybe I'll change it.

00:55:34:13 - 00:55:37:25
Jeff Jarvis
Well we'll look forward to seeing it on Jason's finger soon.

00:55:37:28 - 00:55:39:11
Jason Howell
On my index.

00:55:39:14 - 00:55:40:00
Jeff Jarvis
Finger.

00:55:40:02 - 00:56:08:15
Jason Howell
Finger? All right, this next article has you written all over it. Jeff, I'm not going to lie. This is, semaphore illustrating the battle between test realists and techno optimists, also known as acceleration tests playing out in newsrooms. It sounds like test real network of test real aligned folks are seeding reporters into big name news outlets.

00:56:08:15 - 00:56:09:09
Jason Howell
Am I getting that right?

00:56:09:13 - 00:56:33:27
Jeff Jarvis
Right. So there's the Tarbell Foundation, which has a Tarbell Center for AI journalism, has a Tarbell fellows. And they pay to they've they've they've put journalists into Bloomberg time. The Verge and the LA times. And they're funded by this, this, this foundation. Well, if you look at the foundation, this is reporting from some before from Max Tenney. If you look at the Tarbell Foundation and look at who funds them, and it's all there in public.

00:56:34:05 - 00:57:01:06
Jeff Jarvis
Indeed. It it's coefficient giving which was formerly open philanthropy. That's one of the big, money's behind this whole test. Real world and effective altruism. There's the e infrastructure fund, effective altruism, the Future of Life Institute, which is test grail. The survival and Flourishing fund. How's that for a name that's also here? I think it's I think another one is the AI Safety Tactical Opportunities Fund.

00:57:01:06 - 00:57:07:14
Jeff Jarvis
So these are these are the donors to this organization, which is in turn funding journalism. Now listen.

00:57:07:16 - 00:57:08:00
Jason Howell
Right.

00:57:08:02 - 00:57:32:24
Jeff Jarvis
Google has the Google News initiative. It gives a lot of money to, to to do innovation in journalism. I've raised money from Google and Meta and universities to get their work done. I get all that. And that's fine. What struck me here, though, is that this is about covering AI, and these are people who have very much an agenda in AI and specific to test real and test grail.

00:57:32:27 - 00:57:53:28
Jeff Jarvis
If you don't know what it is these years to answer is Google. It does scale. It's the whole bunch of, I think, faux philosophies that guide many of these guys. Some of them were doomsayers. And so now you have OpenAI. I complained about their coverage of them to one of these outlets, because, it was the doomsayers against the acceleration.

00:57:53:28 - 00:58:16:11
Jeff Jarvis
This is Jason said some before said that they had one of these fellows, but then ended the relationship and never published any of their work, which sounds tantalizing. As to where that goes. So bottom line here is what you're what we've talked about this before with our friend Nir. It was plot that the, the test. Real people have a lot of money.

00:58:16:14 - 00:58:37:06
Jeff Jarvis
A lot a lot of money. And they're investing it not only in and we've talked about this before on the show in creating programs in universities and fellowships in universities and scholarships, universities and so on and so forth. They're doing it to do all kinds of other events and activities, and now they're trying to fund journalism. And so journalism, watch out.

00:58:37:08 - 00:58:57:17
Jason Howell
And then meanwhile, OpenAI, I guess, acceleration is as I, as I call it at the beginning, who are aligned with OpenAI and other AI companies arguing that we should be moving fast on, on this technology because it's going to boost the economy. It's going to help the USB China. So they're kind of pushing back in the opposite direction.

00:58:57:22 - 00:59:02:28
Jason Howell
So is everybody trying to control the newsroom then if we just didn't know about it?

00:59:03:00 - 00:59:06:02
Jeff Jarvis
Well everybody always does. Ever since the invention of PR. Yeah.

00:59:06:02 - 00:59:10:10
Jason Howell
And is that different that that was kind of where I was getting like is is this just kind of.

00:59:10:10 - 00:59:33:25
Jeff Jarvis
How this case it comes with money, it comes with the journalist there. So I heard it from a friend of mine who's a journalist. I respect greatly, who complained to me, about this and said, let me see if I can find it real quickly. Chat. I won't quarter by name. I want you to know the Tar Ball actually works and how little influence EA has over it.

00:59:33:27 - 00:59:59:18
Jeff Jarvis
Okay. But, the transparency about this is critical, and Tarbell is not necessarily the key here. The money is. And you just got to ask, the way I put it in the end was I wouldn't accept a drink paid for them in journalism, first of all. So, it's yarn for the survival and to flourishing fund is yarn telling.

00:59:59:20 - 01:00:08:09
Jeff Jarvis
Easier appears to be a the AI safety tactical opportunities fund appears to be AEA. So it's a lot of effective altruism.

01:00:08:11 - 01:00:17:11
Jason Howell
Okay. Well, if you would like to learn more about Test Grail and what we're kind of talking about here, good news.

01:00:17:11 - 01:00:18:02
Jeff Jarvis
Though, play spend.

01:00:18:02 - 01:00:19:28
Jason Howell
Have an episode. No.

01:00:20:01 - 01:00:20:12
Jeff Jarvis
Yes we.

01:00:20:12 - 01:00:22:23
Jason Howell
Do. We have they do.

01:00:22:23 - 01:00:24:20
Jeff Jarvis
A great job on this topic.

01:00:24:23 - 01:00:45:29
Jason Howell
That's right, that's right. It's, it's episode from July 3rd, 2024, last year called The Test Grill FAQ. Q And Emile does a great job of walking us through what Test Grill actually is and, and all the things. So if you haven't, checked out that episode, definitely do find it. You can go to AI inside Dot show and find it there.

01:00:46:01 - 01:01:04:23
Jason Howell
It's also on YouTube and all the, all the, all the places. So you can learn a little more about that. All right. Sorry, I have to vamp just a little bit because I think I have to pull up an extra thing. Why? Because it is time for. Okay, I got.

01:01:04:25 - 01:01:06:00
Jeff Jarvis
Jeff's. I got you.

01:01:06:00 - 01:01:10:18
Jason Howell
Down. Down and out. All right. Oh, okay. No. Okay, good.

01:01:10:25 - 01:01:35:22
Jeff Jarvis
Three. Tell us three papers real quick. First is, one by Antonio, naturally, and Bronstein from Project City. City and University of Oxford. This is a wacky one. LMS can hide text in other text of the same length. This is a spy kind of thing, right? So you can take a message. The government is corrupt and horrible.

01:01:35:22 - 01:01:57:12
Jeff Jarvis
And if I said this out loud, I would be shot at dawn. And then, the LM can hide that in other text in a way that an LM can decode it easily. Oh, so you can declare it and you can decode it. You can put you can embed it into something as simple and harmless as a recipe.

01:01:57:15 - 01:01:58:27
Jeff Jarvis
And it's a little mind boggling.

01:01:58:27 - 01:02:03:29
Jason Howell
And because you, like a pad is where characters are placed and deciphering and all that kind of thing.

01:02:03:29 - 01:02:12:06
Jeff Jarvis
Exactly, exactly. So I will try to explain it all, but it's it's steganography. It's it's hiding a message in another message. Right.

01:02:12:13 - 01:02:12:28
Jason Howell
Yeah.

01:02:12:28 - 01:02:40:17
Jeff Jarvis
And and what they're saying is lock for, say that, so, so for example, the words the current government has repeatedly failed. Could come out as how lovely. Served with sweet roasted whatever. Right. The same number of words, word for word. And there's a key to make this possible. The key in this case is the infamous British roasted ball sauce.

01:02:40:17 - 01:02:57:18
Jeff Jarvis
How to make it perfect. How does that all work together? It uses the key to encode and encrypt the message in plain text. The key here is because it's an LM, it can pick the words that make the plaintext look intelligible and thus innocent.

01:02:57:20 - 01:02:59:23
Jason Howell
Yeah. It's true. Right.

01:02:59:23 - 01:03:06:22
Jeff Jarvis
So it's not like it's a nonsense code. Alphabet tree. Squirrel, deer.

01:03:06:22 - 01:03:07:19
Jason Howell
Yeah. All right.

01:03:07:21 - 01:03:18:28
Jeff Jarvis
That's that's obviously code. If it's here's my favorite recipe for eggnog in the holidays. And it turns out to be we're all bombing the government at noon. Right?

01:03:18:28 - 01:03:19:13
Jason Howell
Right.

01:03:19:17 - 01:03:32:25
Jeff Jarvis
And so, so it's a little wacky. It's a little strange. It has the recipe for how to do this in here. And it can be done locally on a small limb. So it's just another way to make people freaked out about limbs. So that's.

01:03:32:25 - 01:03:33:19
Jason Howell
Number one. Yeah.

01:03:33:21 - 01:03:34:05
Jeff Jarvis
There you go.

01:03:34:05 - 01:03:47:16
Jason Howell
Number two works in that. It works in the world of words. And wordplay. Yeah, yeah. So of course something like that. And, and the vast, you know, computational capability to match patterns and all these things. So.

01:03:47:19 - 01:04:07:17
Jeff Jarvis
Yeah. And so hiding in plain sight. So why is somebody saying this weird thing you don't know about a recipe? Well, in fact, it's a hidden message. It's a message, right? Number two by a bunch of, academics at the Indian Institute of Technology. David versus Goliath. Can small models win big with the genetic AI and hardware design?

01:04:07:19 - 01:04:29:09
Jeff Jarvis
This is interesting to me because what they what they did was that they looked at trying to take small looms and then use agents to work with them through a flows through decomposing a task, iterative feedback correction and so on. And, it just means that that you can use less technology, less cost, less compute to do things.

01:04:29:11 - 01:04:51:02
Jeff Jarvis
And at the same time, you're training these agents. And so you created a structure that can then work with other smaller labs. So I found that I love looking at these things that people are working on. In the papers and other another area people working on a lot these days is how to, make LMS, trained models forget things like copyrighted material or bad things.

01:04:51:02 - 01:05:10:16
Jeff Jarvis
Right. And you see paper of the paper working on this stuff. And then number three, getting closer because we want to prove that, that, you see, you think this whole, I think has no value. You think it's just worthless? You think it has nothing? Well, let me tell you, folks, it can be used for real time cricket sorting by sex.

01:05:10:18 - 01:05:34:28
Jeff Jarvis
Okay. One manual is this raro. Gullo. And Doctor Matthew Smith from the Illinois Institute of Technology and the Universidad Polytechnic at the Madrid came up with this because the issue is that crickets are seen as a potential major source of protein. But to really work on them well, you need to be able to breed them.

01:05:34:28 - 01:05:58:00
Jeff Jarvis
And to breed them, you've got to figure out the boy crickets from the girl crickets. And that's obviously a difficult task. So they used, a simple construction of a bridge that the crickets walk across or whatever they do, hop across, with a Raspberry Pi and an LM to sex crickets. Some. And coming to.

01:05:58:00 - 01:06:06:19
Jason Howell
Your Raspberry Pi home near you now? No, not actual Pi. Yes. Okay. Yeah. Interesting. And then there's another image there, right?

01:06:06:19 - 01:06:13:29
Jeff Jarvis
Oh, okay. Yeah. So it sorts the cricket there. There's a little arm there that then sorts the crickets. Boys go here, girls there were there.

01:06:14:01 - 01:06:27:20
Jason Howell
And so I love technology. I'm just looking at my own pattern recognition. Male does not seem to have a little thing coming out of the tail. Female does. Did I just figure it out?

01:06:27:23 - 01:06:33:19
Jeff Jarvis
I think you might have figured it out, but not now. Do that at scale, fella. Smart ass. Right?

01:06:33:21 - 01:06:34:03
Jason Howell
Okay.

01:06:34:03 - 01:06:40:07
Jeff Jarvis
And not only that, but move the little critters in the right space. Yeah, yeah. You think you're so smart.

01:06:40:09 - 01:07:00:26
Jason Howell
I thought so, I thought so, I thought I came up with something very novel there, but. No, not at all. Thank you for illustrating these wonderful examples in this section. Jeff Salk I shoot down science. There we go. Science. All right. We're going to take a quick break. Then we got a few speed round items and then we'll get you out of here.

01:07:00:26 - 01:07:10:05
Jason Howell
So hang tight. We'll talk a little bit about, What is it? Oh, I browsers yeah. We got a few things related to AI browsers coming up. So hang tight.

01:07:10:08 - 01:07:14:24
Jason Howell
Okay. So what? We're not supposed to like I browsers anymore? Is that what's going on?

01:07:14:26 - 01:07:34:05
Jeff Jarvis
Danger danger. Will Robinson. Danger danger. Yeah. They're doing all kinds of of bad things. Maybe reverse these two perplexities. Comedy. I browser, was found to be, quietly erasing Google Drive. Once you give it access to your stuff, it can do things with your stuff off.

01:07:34:05 - 01:07:36:20
Jason Howell
So be careful when you give it access. Be very.

01:07:36:20 - 01:07:54:18
Jeff Jarvis
Careful. Right. So that's just one example. And there's others, you know, you can you can do things in your email and so on and your and your drives. So Gartner, the analyst, according to the Register, is now advising to block all AI browsers for the foreseeable future. Just don't use.

01:07:54:21 - 01:07:57:18
Jason Howell
AI. Thank you. Bad it's too murky out there.

01:07:57:21 - 01:08:18:16
Jeff Jarvis
Yeah. But I get it. I mean, I with with the comic browser with perplexity. I eagerly got it. I signed up, and I used it, and then I thought, I don't know. And so I took back the permissions used for use. Comment. Right.

01:08:18:19 - 01:08:23:14
Jason Howell
I do, I don't really use it for genetic stuff, but I use it.

01:08:23:16 - 01:08:27:08
Jeff Jarvis
What do you use it for? Just organizing your tabs and that kind of stuff.

01:08:27:11 - 01:08:54:21
Jason Howell
When I'm creating Rundowns, it, I open a lot of links and I have to synthesize a lot of information. And then, you know, I'm writing a script or whatever, like handwriting a script. And I find it it can be useful sometimes to get like a general summary of the story that I'm reading to kind of form the basis of how I describe something, and then to go into the article and verify the facts.

01:08:54:23 - 01:09:13:14
Jason Howell
And if I do that outside of Comet Browser, I have to do a lot of copy and pasting. Copy this URL over to here into a chat window, type out the command, hit enter, copy and paste it back over here with comet. I just open up all the the things and then I just give it the actions on the things that are open and it.

01:09:13:17 - 01:09:34:06
Jeff Jarvis
Which I and I don't see any danger in that. And I think Gartner maybe going overboard. It's not because they're complaining that, oh my God, there's sensitive user data such as active web content, browsing history, and open tabs. Well, that's exactly what Jason wants to use it for. And it does it for those fun. I think the danger comes when you tie it to your, Google Drive.

01:09:34:09 - 01:09:39:15
Jeff Jarvis
Anything on your own machine? This executable, Gmail and such. That's where the.

01:09:39:15 - 01:10:09:21
Jason Howell
Data, when it's doing actions for you. And that's just like a, that's a general cautionary thing around agent like actions period. Is. Yep. Yes. You are giving something else full control over whatever you give it access to. So be careful and ensure that it doesn't do those things. Yep. And yeah so the responsibility does also fall. You know they need to do a good job on the side of the browsers to make sure that as best as they can, these things don't run amok.

01:10:09:21 - 01:10:20:08
Jason Howell
But you as a user, you also have to have responsibility over what you give it access to. And I. Which is not to say that I don't I don't agree with what Gartner is saying here. I think it's important to be cautious.

01:10:20:14 - 01:10:32:06
Jeff Jarvis
Yeah. Well, the thing that I love best about browser, what I used was to be able to say, take this and send an email, I love that, take this and add this to my calendar, I love that, but then it has access to my Google Drive.

01:10:32:08 - 01:10:39:09
Jason Howell
Yeah, yeah. See, it's funny, I have hardly used it for anything like that. Maybe I did when.

01:10:39:09 - 01:10:40:29
Jeff Jarvis
I was in demo mode.

01:10:41:01 - 01:11:01:25
Jason Howell
Yeah, maybe. Okay. Yeah, maybe if I had like fully committed to comet as my everyday browser, which it's still not my default, you know, I use it for. I open it when I prepare for a show. Right. Maybe if I had gone all in, I might get to that point, because it seems to take me a while to, like, go, oh, you know what I could do?

01:11:01:25 - 01:11:31:19
Jason Howell
I don't know why I never thought of that before. It takes me longer than I think. It takes other people to do that. But anyways, let's see here, open AI, a few a few ChatGPT integrations to know about. First of all, Instacart offering a new experience inside of ChatGPT. So this allows you so you're using ChatGPT High Bronson, using ChatGPT to, you know, brainstorm recipes or whatever.

01:11:31:19 - 01:11:39:07
Jason Howell
And you can turn that into a quick, grocery checklist or, you know, that that gets imported into Instacart and.

01:11:39:10 - 01:11:59:20
Jeff Jarvis
This makes perfect sense given that, Federico, who was at meta and then was the CEO of Instacart, is now the CEO of product at, OpenAI. I o so as the synergy becomes apparent there that if anybody was going to integrate the two, it was going to be Instacart and OpenAI.

01:11:59:23 - 01:12:22:16
Jason Howell
Right? Okay. Yeah. I mean, that makes a lot of sense that if you're using ChatGPT for that sort of thing, it would be nice to just be like, okay, let's take it over here and we're just going to see more and more partnerships that yeah, yeah, yeah. Things like that possible like Adobe bringing Photoshop, Photoshop Express or Express and Acrobat into ChatGPT.

01:12:22:19 - 01:12:48:07
Jason Howell
So, you know, feasibly you could edit your images, build your designs, work with, PDFs on a deeper level inside of the chat bot, inform and instruct it. I will definitely be testing this out just because I use Adobe's suite of, of products on a regular basis. But you can kind of see like what that might look like, and it taps into, you know, has a little call out, like Adobe Photoshop and yeah.

01:12:48:09 - 01:13:01:18
Jeff Jarvis
This is a dumb question. Because I don't use Adobe that much. Is there a branded equivalent, or would be equivalent to nano banana in Adobe? Or instead, is AI functionality just weaved throughout?

01:13:01:20 - 01:13:09:14
Jason Howell
No, Adobe has Firefly. That's that's kind of there. I, you know, generative AI product.

01:13:09:14 - 01:13:11:28
Jeff Jarvis
So does that include it in this?

01:13:12:01 - 01:13:18:13
Jason Howell
Well, that's a good question. Yeah. Actually, I don't know. I don't know if that is part of this.

01:13:18:13 - 01:13:20:19
Jeff Jarvis
Because it's kind of redundant. Then potentially.

01:13:20:19 - 01:13:28:11
Jason Howell
Yeah. Well it's kind of like if you're already in ChatGPT and you want to do certain things and you feel comfortable.

01:13:28:15 - 01:13:29:06
Jeff Jarvis
Well, in a way it's better.

01:13:29:08 - 01:13:33:05
Jason Howell
That eventually you're going to bring it into Photoshop or whatever. Then, you know.

01:13:33:06 - 01:13:36:07
Jeff Jarvis
Right in Photoshop is more in your control.

01:13:36:09 - 01:13:43:26
Jason Howell
So users can now tell ChatGPT to use Photoshop to edit specific parts of the images, remove or blur the background, adjust exposure brightness.

01:13:43:28 - 01:13:53:19
Jeff Jarvis
So it's another way to you. It's it's a UI. It brings brings the chat UI to Adobe products, which is very interesting.

01:13:53:22 - 01:14:04:28
Jason Howell
How does this differ from instructing ChatGPT to remove or blur the background when Adobe Photoshop isn't integrated is a question that I have.

01:14:05:03 - 01:14:09:11
Jeff Jarvis
I kind of trust Adobe to do a better job of it.

01:14:09:13 - 01:14:10:06
Jason Howell
I'm sure you.

01:14:10:12 - 01:14:13:23
Jeff Jarvis
Could add a sixth finger.

01:14:13:26 - 01:14:20:17
Jason Howell
You never know. Yeah. Yeah, I don't know. I want to play around with it to kind of understand the delineation.

01:14:20:17 - 01:14:24:01
Jeff Jarvis
It'd be interesting to hear your report. Yep, yep.

01:14:24:04 - 01:14:44:19
Jason Howell
See if see if it actually becomes useful or if it's like, oh, you know, like, do we quickly head down the road that we had to down with, Google Assistant where it could do a bazillion things because everyone was making integrations into it. And and yet you didn't use any of this. He didn't know they existed or whatever the case may be.

01:14:44:22 - 01:15:04:21
Jason Howell
Don't know. But nonetheless, I'm sure we'll see more of that as a general trend. And then speaking of trends, we've got dang, why did I just do that? There we go. We've got Google's year end trends report, for search year in Search 2025. And, I don't know if you did a like an exhaustive look through this.

01:15:04:21 - 01:15:09:03
Jason Howell
I didn't I, I relied on search engine land. Danny Goodwin.

01:15:09:08 - 01:15:11:06
Jeff Jarvis
Well, so what's interesting to me about this, about.

01:15:11:06 - 01:15:11:26
Jason Howell
This. But.

01:15:11:28 - 01:15:25:24
Jeff Jarvis
Yeah, it's not just what what was in it. It's also how Google presented at this time, which is really interesting. I so if you go back to the year in search, let's say go to entertainment, if you go to scroll down.

01:15:25:27 - 01:15:51:13
Jeff Jarvis
You're there now scroll down. There we go. Yeah. Entertainment. Yep. Oh. And then go to come on, come on Google. Come on. You can do it. Click on it. Click on the plus. Click on the plus. Click on it. There we go. There you go okay. Right. So actors the trending actors Mikey Madsen, Louis Pulliam, Isabella Moore said Song Yi Joon woo and Caitlin Dever.

01:15:51:15 - 01:15:52:05
Jason Howell
Okay, I'm.

01:15:52:05 - 01:15:54:27
Jeff Jarvis
Old, I don't know, I know.

01:15:54:29 - 01:15:55:16
Jason Howell
Like,

01:15:55:19 - 01:16:18:03
Jeff Jarvis
I'm so out of it, but Google now does a picture me a favor. It has catch me up in AI mode. Click on that and a very handy page comes up explaining each of these, and it starts to make you see how a smart publisher could use AI mode in what they do. Jason has thinking turned on.

01:16:18:03 - 01:16:38:16
Jeff Jarvis
So you long time to do it. Oh, mine came up pretty quickly. But, Yeah. Yeah, it's it's you. No, it should be the same. Mine came up pretty quickly. So, Mikey Madison was the most searched actor globally following her best Actress Oscar. March the dove for portrayal of Brooks, the Brooklyn sex worker, in an Ora.

01:16:38:21 - 01:16:56:12
Jeff Jarvis
Okay, okay. Right. So it wouldn't have been hard to Google all of these people. It would have been hard for a media company to insert all of that. But this is a nice, easy way to say, okay, here's a list. Boom! Teach me war. And it made me think of a new way for media to operate using AI.

01:16:56:15 - 01:17:03:16
Jeff Jarvis
Expand this for me. Explain this to me. That kind of button should be everywhere on sites.

01:17:03:19 - 01:17:28:19
Jason Howell
Interesting. Okay. So yeah, you've got the the catch me up in AI mode integrated into there. I'm going to file that away. And to remember that in a few days for an unspecified reason. Let's see here we got podcasts, we got books. You know, all different kinds of trends throughout everything. Oh, and you can go back in time to see what was trending in a different year as well.

01:17:28:19 - 01:17:52:21
Jason Howell
Does it include the AI mode thing there too? No it doesn't. So it's only only the current one that gives you the AI looks. It looks like. That's neat. To search. Oh, wow. Interesting. Hum. To search. Trending songs. Top golden Hunter X. That was the, the, animated movie on Netflix that just took the world by storm very unexpectedly ordinary.

01:17:52:21 - 01:18:04:06
Jason Howell
Okay, so these are all the songs that people hummed into their their search box to try and identify. That's interesting that they call that out, but that's that's super fascinating to me.

01:18:04:09 - 01:18:16:22
Jeff Jarvis
Another thing, I use Google Maps. I search on Google Maps most for as their first listed area, which is bookstore. I'm always asking for bookstore near me. That's a good sign for humanity. People are looking for bookstores.

01:18:16:24 - 01:18:35:22
Jason Howell
Yes, indeed. And speaking of, why is that important? Well, for Jeff, it's pretty important because Jeff is a writer of books and author of books. You can go to Jeff jarvis.com, find Hot Type at least a preorder for Hot Type, his upcoming book, his latest book.

01:18:35:25 - 01:18:39:03
Jeff Jarvis
Just finished the copy I read on Monday.

01:18:39:05 - 01:18:41:12
Jason Howell
How do you feel?

01:18:41:15 - 01:19:04:07
Jeff Jarvis
Okay. You know, it's, I'm going through for the 20th time, and there was. I'll give you one example. I meant to say either 1800s or 19th century. I said 19th century, which is a hundred years off. And so then I'm scared to death. What other stupid mistakes like that are through it? It's a book about seller. I misspelled his name twice.

01:19:04:10 - 01:19:25:14
Jason Howell
It's frightening. Look, we are humans. We are imperfect. It's just the way it is. Yeah. That would. That would drive me in like crazy. Wondering what's what's in there that I haven't caught yet. Because I know there's something. And for me, there's probably a lot of somethings. So there you go. Nonetheless, it's going to be fantastic when it comes out hot type.

01:19:25:17 - 01:19:49:28
Jason Howell
You can get Gutenberg, parenthesis magazine and the web. We we've right now as you wait, that can be your, that can be your, your your, pre your warm up for hot type when it comes to. Right. I inside dot show for everything about this show. All the ways to subscribe find all of our episodes, including the episode from a few days ago with, XLR director Justin Payne from Google.

01:19:49:28 - 01:20:20:27
Jason Howell
Definitely check that out if you have not already. And then Patreon.com slash AI Inside Show is where you can go to support us on a deeper level. We appreciate when you do that. We have some amazing executive producers who help us each and every week. Doctor Du Jeffrey Mary Cheyney, Radio Asheville, one of 3.7 Dante Saint, James Barnard, Eric Jason Cipher, Jason Brady, Anthony Downs, Mark Archer, and Carsten Szymanski who did confirm that I got it right.

01:20:21:04 - 01:20:21:25
Jeff Jarvis
Yes. Party.

01:20:22:02 - 01:20:43:06
Jason Howell
So yay, Carson. I'm happy. I'm happy that you told me that I can I can sleep easy tonight. So thank you for, supporting us on a on a deeper level. Thank you, everyone, for just watching and listening and subscribing and reviewing reviews on Apple Podcasts. Still waiting for a new review to appear there. I'll just to keep saying it.

01:20:43:07 - 01:20:52:22
Jason Howell
It'll happen. One of these days. And, I think that's it. Definitely check out Jeff's other podcast, by the way, Intelligent Machines. He's going to be on that this afternoon.

01:20:52:25 - 01:20:54:18
Jeff Jarvis
Jason was last week subbing for.

01:20:54:19 - 01:21:06:19
Jason Howell
Yeah, it was it was a ton of fun. I was seven for you, and I had a blast with Leo in Paris, so check that out, too. All right. Good. Wrap it up. Thank you, everybody, for watching. Listening. We'll see you next time on AI inside AI.